avevale_intelligencer (![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
avevale_intelligencer) wrote2005-07-27 04:04 pm
avevale_intelligencer) wrote2005-07-27 04:04 pm
Entry tags:
Point for discussion....
I have a problem with roleplaying, and it is this: I roleplay.
The object of roleplaying is to create a character different from oneself, and I have had some success at doing this. At the same time, I’m somewhat limited by my own nature, and there are some kinds of character I cannot, or will not, play. For instance, I’ll never play an evil character. I rolled one up once, but he was too messed up to be fun to play either for others or myself. Also, I’m a devil for consistency, in my own limited way.
Example. I started a bard character back in the days of Advanced D&D first edition. For those who aren’t familiar with that system, a bard had to start out as a fighter, get to sixth level or thereabouts and then start again as a first level thief. Once he got to the same level as a thief, he was at last allowed to start yet again as a first level bard. (One DM interpreted this to mean that till he got to actual bard level he wasn’t even allowed to have a reasonable singing voice…) If you wanted to be a bard in those days, you had to be determined and careful. So my bard character rapidly became an obsessive paranoid. He always ended up de facto leader of any party, not because he wanted to be, but because he couldn’t trust anyone else not to land the party in trouble. He hated magic, he hated undead, he wasn’t really keen on adventuring but he did it because he had to. He got as far as first level thief before we moved and I stopped dungeoning regularly, but he stopped being fun to play long before that…but that was how he had to be. I couldn’t see any other way he could logically have developed.
Anyway, now I am trying out this new roleplaying environment (EVE Online), in which character death is apparently quite frequent, but not a problem because you have a clone in storage somewhere, which gets activated upon your demise. True, it doesn’t necessarily have all your abilities, and your ship (which is almost certainly the most important and expensive possession you have) is gone, but at least you’re alive to start all over again from the bottom. Other players I know have died many many times, and are quite laid-back about this, and they feel the character would be the same.
I totally and flatly disagree. This may be my limited outlook showing through again, but I do not believe that a sane human being would ever become laid-back about dying. It’s a traumatic and painful experience, whose roots go right down to the animal core of our being, and no amount of intellectual knowledge about clones and such will make it any less terrifying a prospect. After all, while the new clone may believe itself to be the same person, there is no transfer of consciousness (as far as I know) so for the one dying death is just as final as it will be for any of us out here.
To me, you see, the character should not know s/he’s a character. Their lives are real to them, and that is how they have to be played. When they’re trapped in their lifepod, seeing the missile coming that will blow them into frozen globs of organic gunk floating in space, they won’t be thinking “that’s all right, I’ll be back in a minute or two, swear for a couple of minutes and carry on.” They will be thinking “I AM GOING TO DIE!” And this rational fear of death will have an effect on how the character develops. Anything else is either a mark of insanity, or of inconsistent roleplaying.
This attitude of mine, of course, means I don’t enjoy roleplaying nearly as much as others with whom I’ve played. The character I’m playing now has run halfway across the galaxy because he made a stupid mistake and endangered his own life and that of another character. The other character’s player cannot understand why I’m playing it this way, why my bloke can’t just laugh it off and carry on as normal. I can’t see how a sane human being, which is what I’m playing, could react any other way.
So: what do you think? How do you play your characters? How do you feel when they die? How do they feel when they think they’re going to die? Does it matter?
The object of roleplaying is to create a character different from oneself, and I have had some success at doing this. At the same time, I’m somewhat limited by my own nature, and there are some kinds of character I cannot, or will not, play. For instance, I’ll never play an evil character. I rolled one up once, but he was too messed up to be fun to play either for others or myself. Also, I’m a devil for consistency, in my own limited way.
Example. I started a bard character back in the days of Advanced D&D first edition. For those who aren’t familiar with that system, a bard had to start out as a fighter, get to sixth level or thereabouts and then start again as a first level thief. Once he got to the same level as a thief, he was at last allowed to start yet again as a first level bard. (One DM interpreted this to mean that till he got to actual bard level he wasn’t even allowed to have a reasonable singing voice…) If you wanted to be a bard in those days, you had to be determined and careful. So my bard character rapidly became an obsessive paranoid. He always ended up de facto leader of any party, not because he wanted to be, but because he couldn’t trust anyone else not to land the party in trouble. He hated magic, he hated undead, he wasn’t really keen on adventuring but he did it because he had to. He got as far as first level thief before we moved and I stopped dungeoning regularly, but he stopped being fun to play long before that…but that was how he had to be. I couldn’t see any other way he could logically have developed.
Anyway, now I am trying out this new roleplaying environment (EVE Online), in which character death is apparently quite frequent, but not a problem because you have a clone in storage somewhere, which gets activated upon your demise. True, it doesn’t necessarily have all your abilities, and your ship (which is almost certainly the most important and expensive possession you have) is gone, but at least you’re alive to start all over again from the bottom. Other players I know have died many many times, and are quite laid-back about this, and they feel the character would be the same.
I totally and flatly disagree. This may be my limited outlook showing through again, but I do not believe that a sane human being would ever become laid-back about dying. It’s a traumatic and painful experience, whose roots go right down to the animal core of our being, and no amount of intellectual knowledge about clones and such will make it any less terrifying a prospect. After all, while the new clone may believe itself to be the same person, there is no transfer of consciousness (as far as I know) so for the one dying death is just as final as it will be for any of us out here.
To me, you see, the character should not know s/he’s a character. Their lives are real to them, and that is how they have to be played. When they’re trapped in their lifepod, seeing the missile coming that will blow them into frozen globs of organic gunk floating in space, they won’t be thinking “that’s all right, I’ll be back in a minute or two, swear for a couple of minutes and carry on.” They will be thinking “I AM GOING TO DIE!” And this rational fear of death will have an effect on how the character develops. Anything else is either a mark of insanity, or of inconsistent roleplaying.
This attitude of mine, of course, means I don’t enjoy roleplaying nearly as much as others with whom I’ve played. The character I’m playing now has run halfway across the galaxy because he made a stupid mistake and endangered his own life and that of another character. The other character’s player cannot understand why I’m playing it this way, why my bloke can’t just laugh it off and carry on as normal. I can’t see how a sane human being, which is what I’m playing, could react any other way.
So: what do you think? How do you play your characters? How do you feel when they die? How do they feel when they think they’re going to die? Does it matter?
no subject
(Anonymous) 2005-07-28 12:10 pm (UTC)(link)As to how death should happen in RPGs: I was appalled when I read in the rules for HEROQUEST a statement that's been repeated here: 'Death should never be the result of a die roll'.
In my opinion having a model of how the universe works and a set of game mechanics that allow you to determine randomly how death comes and to whom is the only thing that makes RPGs capable of handling death at all. Because if I have to say to my players 'Artistically speaking, I think your characters should die now' then it will shortly kill any sign of friendship I have with my players. Let us agree the rules and then let us play. And let the dice decide....
Michael Cule
GM for Hire
Gaming Dinosaur Second Class
no subject
In a properly run game, death, if it happens, is not the result of a die roll, but of a series of choices made by the character. The die roll just furnishes confirmation. It's not random. If it were, there would be no point in the characters making choices at all.
So yes, you do say to your players, in effect, "Artistically speaking, I think your characters should die now," and if you've run the game properly, they may be upset about it, but they agree with you, *as players*, that that is the logically necessary result of their actions. They would have far more reason to complain if "oops, sorry, just as you're wiping your sword having polished off the last Archdemon a grand piano falls on your head." (Unless that was a feature of the game that they had a chance to find out about beforehand, I hasten to add...)
Having said that, it is my proud boast that I've never permanently killed a character, nor (if I ever game again) do I intend to. They're much more fun alive...
As for EVE, I go with
Not how I play.
no subject
(Anonymous) 2005-07-28 08:46 pm (UTC)(link)What I suppose I'm saying is that I like my worlds to have the quality that shit sometimes happens. Sometimes you fumble and the sword goes through your own thigh. Sometimes you die as meaninglessly as Tasha Yar. And that's just the way it is.
Michael Cule
Aging Gamer Geek.
no subject
no subject
no subject
Out Of Gas is superb.
"But Mal, what do you need two mechanics for?"
"Really don't."
no subject